Cookie Cutters

[cookiedough]

These are six week SHICs (Short High Intensity Cutters) with 4 week PCTs = 10 week total cycle time. This cycle was written by Yohimbe with input from Freak Of Nature (many thanks for the guidance and support).

This is an experimental cooperative cycle to illustrate how the same compounds taken on the same dosing schedule affect different body types. It should also give new insights into SHICs for regular fat guys like us Should help w/the motivation as well.

Any and all comments, questions are welcome and we both plan to log as often as possible during the 10 weeks.

Start: Monday 5/31/2010
PCT End: Sunday 8/8/1

Cookie's Starting Stats:
5'11"
175 pounds
15% BF (taken w/BodPod)
Diet: ketosis w/3,000 calories ED
Goals: Decrease BF 2-5%, add strength, maintain current body weight or slight increase.
Weights: 10 reps minimum w/near failure on last two reps. Chest, Back, Legs, Shoulders, Arms; one group per day, rest day(s) as needed
Cardio: 1 hour at 140 bpm/min. EOD (not on leg day or on rest days).
Abs: 3-4 days per week, gravity only

BoKnows' Starting Stats:
6'6"
245 pounds
25.5% BF (taken w/bio impedence)
Diet: ketosis w/5,000 calories ED
Goals: Decrease BF 5-8%, add lean mass, add strength
Weights: 1 hour x 5 wkly: 4 sets 8 reps each muscle group x2
Cardio: 5x wkly: 30 mins HIIT/ 150-170 bpm
Abs/core: light training x 5 wkly

Yohimbe's Starting Stats:
5'10"
210 pounds
xx% BF (taken w/calipers)
Diet: calorie restricted Keto @ 2,100 calories ED, 1 carb load meal wkly
Goals: Decrease BF x-x%, not concerned with total body weight
Weights: EOD, low sets, 8-10 reps per body part, 4 day body split-no longer than 45 min. sessions
Cardio: 20 minutes HIIT, 3x wk (not on non weight training days)
Abs: 3-4 times wkly, 3 supersets of 20 total supersets

Cookie Cutter 1:

Test Prop
Wk 1: 1,400 mg front load @ 200 mg ED
Wks 2-6: 700 mg @ 200 mg EOD
Tren Ace
Wks 1-6: 350 mg @ 100 mg EOD
Mast
Wks 1-6: 525 mg @ 150 mg EOD
T3
Wks 3-6: 700 mcg @ 100 mcg ED
HCG
Wks 1-7: 700 ius @ 100 ius ED
Bromo
Wks 1-6: 125 mg @ 2.5 mg m-f
Aromasin
Wks 1-6: 174 mg @ 25 mg ED
Vitamins
Wks 1-10: E, C, B-12, Zinc, Magnesium, EFA All taken ED, Kelp Wks 6-10

PCT
Nolva
Wks 7 & 8: 40 mg ED
Wks 9-10: 20 mg ED

Bo Cutter 1:

Test Prop
wk1: front load 1400mg/ 200 mg ed
wks 2-6: 200 mg EOD
Tren Ace
wks 1-6 525mg/ 150mg eod
Mast
wks 1-6 350 mg/ 150 mg eod
T-3
wks 3-6 700mg/ 100ed
Clen
wks 1-6, 2-4 350mcg/50mcg ed
Aromasin
wks 1-6 175mmg/25 mg ed
Cabergoline
wks 1-6 50mg/ 25 mg twice a wk
udca
wks 1-6 3500mg/ 500mg ed

PCT
HCG 700/ 100iu ed
Arimadex 7mg/ 1mg ed
Vitamins
gnc vitapac multi vitamin, 300mg fish oil ed, glucosamine/ condroitin 1500 mg ed, b-12 inject 1400mg/ 200ed, Taurine for clen cramps

Yohimbe Cutter 1

Test Prop
wk1: front load 1,200mg
Wks 2-6: 800-900 mg
Tren Ace
wks 1-6 350mg
DBol
wks 2-6 50 mg ED
HCG
Wks 2, 3 & 5: 500 ius
T-3
wks 3-6 700mg/ 100ed (titrating up & down)
Letro
wks 1-6: .25 mg ED
Bromo: 2.5 mg Every 3rd day

PCT
Clen
wks 7-10 125 mcg ED (titrating up)
Nolva
wks 7-10: 40 mg ED
HCG
Wk 7: 500 ius

Good link explaining different BF testing methods: http://www.new-fitness.com/body_fat_analyzing.html


The cycles are the same, essentially, but have slight changes. Notice that Cookie 1 has hcg IN cycle, Bo 1 has hcg IN pct & Yo 1 has it both (pulsed through cycle/pct). Also, Cookie 1 does NOT have Clen, Bo 1 has clen in cycle & Yo 1 has clen in pct. The pct regimens are slightly different due to availability of compounds and personal preferences. The daily caloric intake is different for each also.

[yohimbe]

Good stuff Cookie-sent you a pm.

[prime]

yo and cd, do you need to front load the prop? doesn't prop reach levels in 3 days?

[yohimbe]

The half life is 4 days so it takes about a week to reach decent blood levels, with a frontload in the first week you'll hit the levels by day 4.
If you're pinning 100mg EOD, on day 1 you pin 100mg, so 25mg will hit blood stream on day 1, day 2, day 3 and day 4. You pin another 100mg day 3 so you will have 50mg in blood stream day 3 day 4 and so on

If you pin 100mg ED for the first week it will be 25mg day 1, 50mg day 2, 75mg day 3 100mg day 4 etc so you've peaked the blood levels much quicker, and then go to maintenance dose in week 2

[Replicator]

Nice work Cookie , hope it goes well
rep

[boknows21075]

Sent you a pm to fill xs, cookie. Thanx for all the hard work. Thanx to yo and freak for their contributions/ participation. For forum / discussion purposes, I think this is a great idea and am honored to take part. Thanx for the oppurtunity, cd... Now lets get fn ripped!!!

[WetWorks]

looks good, but why are you taking Bromo and Aromasin? when your taking Mast during your SHIC.

[boknows21075]

Originally Posted by WetWorks

looks good, but why are you taking Bromo and Aromasin? when your taking Mast during your SHIC.

The theory, for myself, is that the cabergoline/ bromo will alleviate any potential sides f/ the tren/ prolactin. And the aromasin is for the sides f/ the prop. I realize that mast acts as a mild anti-e, but the aromasin willhelp w/ any aromatizing that gets missed. You are wayyyyyyy more knowledgable than myself, do you think adjustments should be made?

[WetWorks]

Originally Posted by boknows21075

The theory, for myself, is that the cabergoline/ bromo will alleviate any potential sides f/ the tren/ prolactin. And the aromasin is for the sides f/ the prop. I realize that mast acts as a mild anti-e, but the aromasin willhelp w/ any aromatizing that gets missed. You are wayyyyyyy more knowledgable than myself, do you think adjustments should be made?

I knew why you guys are using those compounds, but I personally think your over killing the estrogen reduction. I think Mast should be all you need. you need estrogen to grow and need estrogen to lube your joints. sense your running Prop, chances of it aromatizing into estrogen is slim to none. it is very hard to get gyno from Tren, you usually have to mix it with Deca to get progesterone gyno. I would use Caber if I was running both Deca an Tren at the same time. you guys know your bodies better than me, so don't let me change your minds if thats what you want to try. I also would use Aromasin if I was using a compound that aromatizes more than Prop.

[boknows21075]

Originally Posted by WetWorks

I knew why you guys are using those compounds, but I personally think your over killing the estrogen reduction. I think Mast should be all you need. you need estrogen to grow and need estrogen to lube your joints. sense your running Prop, chances of it aromatizing into estrogen is slim to none. it is very hard to get gyno from Tren, you usually have to mix it with Deca to get progesterone gyno. I would use Caber if I was running both Deca an Tren at the same time. you guys know your bodies better than me, so don't let me change your minds if thats what you want to try. I also would use Aromasin if I was using a compound that aromatizes more than Prop.

I see. Perhaps I ll rethink the aromasin. I got noticable estrogen reductions f/ mast. As for the cabergoline, I am extremely prone to gynos and tend to get them f/ decca alone. Based on that, do you agree w/ its inclusion?

[conan]

Are all three of you guys going to be using the same brand of products?

[boknows21075]

I know that cookie and I are mostly going to be using the same brand products. As for yo, Im not sure. That applioes only to the aas not anti e's etc.

[cookiedough]

Originally Posted by WetWorks

looks good, but why are you taking Bromo and Aromasin? when your taking Mast during your SHIC.

I had light gyno symptoms during last SHIC w/Prop and mast at same doses. This is my first SHIC w/Tren admittedly a little gun shy. Freak recommended the bromo/aromasin add in for me. I'm working in large doses of EFAs and considering Glucosamine, Chondroitin for the joints. I'll back down on the Bromo/Aromasin if I get creaky/sore joints.

Originally Posted by conan

Are all three of you guys going to be using the same brand of products?

Scrioxx for Prop, Mast, Tren Ace for me. Mix of other brands on the other stuff.

[boknows21075]

Originally Posted by cookiedough

I had light gyno symptoms during last SHIC w/Prop and mast at same doses. This is my first SHIC w/Tren admittedly a little gun shy. Freak recommended the bromo/aromasin add in for me. I'm working in large doses of EFAs and considering Glucosamine, Chondroitin for the joints. I'll back down on the Bromo/Aromasin if I get creaky/sore joints.

Scrioxx for Prop, Mast, Tren Ace for me. Mix of other brands on the other stuff.

almost identical to cd. Brand same. Potential joint problems handled w/ condrointin/ glucosamine. Past gynos dictate aromasin/ caber

[WetWorks]

Originally Posted by boknows21075

I see. Perhaps I ll rethink the aromasin. I got noticable estrogen reductions f/ mast. As for the cabergoline, I am extremely prone to gynos and tend to get them f/ decca alone. Based on that, do you agree w/ its inclusion?

yes Caber would be good to include.

[WetWorks]

[QUOTE=cookiedough;90679]I had light gyno symptoms during last SHIC w/Prop and mast at same doses. This is my first SHIC w/Tren admittedly a little gun shy. Freak recommended the bromo/aromasin add in for me. I'm working in large doses of EFAs and considering Glucosamine, Chondroitin for the joints. I'll back down on the Bromo/Aromasin if I get creaky/sore joints.

I understand, like I said don't let me talk you guys out of it. I have had bad gyno twice and know its not a good look lol you guys know your body better than me. I try not to limit my gains by using anti-e's

[cookiedough]

[QUOTE=WetWorks;90715]

Originally Posted by cookiedough

I had light gyno symptoms during last SHIC w/Prop and mast at same doses. This is my first SHIC w/Tren admittedly a little gun shy. Freak recommended the bromo/aromasin add in for me. I'm working in large doses of EFAs and considering Glucosamine, Chondroitin for the joints. I'll back down on the Bromo/Aromasin if I get creaky/sore joints.

I understand, like I said don't let me talk you guys out of it. I have had bad gyno twice and know its not a good look lol you guys know your body better than me. I try not to limit my gains by using anti-e's

Thanks, the fewer compounds the better IMO and I agree on the gains issue. I'm gonna run w/the original plan, but am agile enough to adjust if needed. No ego here, just wanna do the best I can w/reaching my goals. Pretty amped up to start early a.m. almost pinned 2night just to c if I get tren cough or not.

[WetWorks]

[QUOTE=cookiedough;90717]

Originally Posted by WetWorks

Thanks, the fewer compounds the better IMO and I agree on the gains issue. I'm gonna run w/the original plan, but am agile enough to adjust if needed. No ego here, just wanna do the best I can w/reaching my goals. Pretty amped up to start early a.m. almost pinned 2night just to c if I get tren cough or not.

I love Tren and the Tren cough lets you know your alive

[cookiedough]

[QUOTE=WetWorks;90718]

Originally Posted by cookiedough

I love Tren and the Tren cough lets you know your alive

FUnny, I'll post up later tomo b/c no wifi at job tomo (yes working 9 hour shift on holiday).

[yohimbe]

My stuff is home brew except the dbol-Dynasty labs.

I'm quite estrogen sensitive so am using higher dose of letro than most, but am also not using an DHT drug to help as an anti e-was thinking of adding some winny, but am worried about the joints-I suffer on winny unless I run NPP. Also want to keep estrogen low, at the beginning at least, in case of progesterone problems.

Thanks Cookie for adding all the info and drawing up the thread

[cookiedough]

Originally Posted by yohimbe

My stuff is home brew except the dbol-Dynasty labs.

I'm quite estrogen sensitive so am using higher dose of letro than most, but am also not using an DHT drug to help as an anti e-was thinking of adding some winny, but am worried about the joints-I suffer on winny unless I run NPP. Also want to keep estrogen low, at the beginning at least, in case of progesterone problems.

Thanks Cookie for adding all the info and drawing up the thread

You are welcome and it's the least I can do for all you've taught me RE: cycles and for writing them all this year. So, many thanks in return my friend.

[cookiedough]

First pins, I shot tren separately to test 4 cough & no coughing. Shot 45 mins b4 lifting and was completely flat, weak workout. That's been a trend in the last 2 weeks b/c I had a nasty chest cold last month but fully recovered now. A buddy commented that I'm hardly vascular as well. Odd comment, but honest.

WOrking ridiculous hours and going to bed early to get some needed rest.

Question for Yohimbe RE: Abs training. Are you doing resistance training w/weights or just gravity work?

[yohimbe]

Originally Posted by cookiedough

First pins, I shot tren separately to test 4 cough & no coughing. Shot 45 mins b4 lifting and was completely flat, weak workout. That's been a trend in the last 2 weeks b/c I had a nasty chest cold last month but fully recovered now. A buddy commented that I'm hardly vascular as well. Odd comment, but honest.

WOrking ridiculous hours and going to bed early to get some needed rest.

Question for Yohimbe RE: Abs training. Are you doing resistance training w/weights or just gravity work?

Mostly crunches and leg raises etc, but will sometime add in a crunch machine, but usually not.

Good to hear there was no tren cough or anything-good start.
Bo, how did yours go?
Try get some rest Cookie

[yohimbe]

Did my first pin-50mg tren and 200mg test prop-going to pin daily to try keep blood levels as stable as possible.

Pretty uneventful, pec shot, no tren cough or anything and just a slight post injection sting at the site.

[boknows21075]

Originally Posted by yohimbe

Mostly crunches and leg raises etc, but will sometime add in a crunch machine, but usually not.

Good to hear there was no tren cough or anything-good start.
Bo, how did yours go?
Try get some rest Cookie

Injcts went well enough.God, its good to be back on! No tren cough. Ws kinda lookin forward to it, tell the truth.No post shot soreness out of the ordinary. Didnt make gym yesterday. Goin tonight, though. Hittin chest and tris. I was woried about energy level b/c of the keto (on day 2, now), but I m feelin pretty good. Adding mct oil to shakes while on keto. Supposed to give added energy. Lookin for a good pump, tonight. Im determined. Got a digital caliper, today. Gonna take some measurements, later. Still gonna use the tanita as my comparison, though.