do i absolutely need hcg

[lougizzle]

Hello,
Been a while since I posted im lookin to put on some mass now and bulk up. 31 yrs old 5 10 155lbs. Slim. Im going to run a test only cycle 8-12 weeks. I have nolva and clomid also. My question is do I need hcg for this cycle or should I be ok as far as recovery goes. Im ready to o but missing hcg and I see most rec it. Can I do shorter test cycles and not need it? please help fellas. thx

[lougizzle]

Ive been workin out steady for few years I was at 130 ish before I started and I kinda stuck right now at 155. Im not tryin to be a body builder just want to be noticed a little more and put on some size. Maybe 175 -180 would be ideal. 1st real cycle coming up so any advise would be appreciated. Ive read all the articles here that I can. I have a pretty good understanding of how this all works. after reading for months Im ready to go.

[Gman]

Stick to the standard cycle length of 12 weeks of test at 500mg per week, should gain 15-20# then look up the standard PCT cycle in the pct section there are several threads about when to start, what to use, how much and how long. Cheers

[lougizzle]

thank bro Im ready to go I have eveything except hcg so thats why I ask. I have clomid nolva tribulus dbol test. First cycle so I didnt know if hcg was a necessity? Can I get by on the standard 22 day pct without hcg? Will I crash that hard?

[yohimbe]

At 5-10 155 you need to work on your diet. Lay out your diet-if you're diets crap you won't make the most of your gains.

I think hcg is a good thing to run as it will help you recover, and thats the most important part of the cycle.
Also, drop the clomid and go with only the nolva-clomid ios a mild esteogen and can exaccerbate gyno during delicate pct period.

Lay out your diet as this is critical.

[lougizzle]

Well Im tryin to put it together still. I was wondering because my metabolism is through the roof. Is the point of eating 6-8 times daily to speed up your metabolism? I need mine slowed done. Would it make sense for me to eat fewe larger meals. I usually eat 2 protein shakes daily and 2 meals. Is tough I work twelve hour days 6 days wekly. Im pretty ripped chest, arms, etc, but i want to pit on some inches on arms chest etc what u think? I usually get 2000-2500 calories and 200g potein give or take

[yohimbe]

Originally Posted by lougizzle

Well Im tryin to put it together still. I was wondering because my metabolism is through the roof. Is the point of eating 6-8 times daily to speed up your metabolism? I need mine slowed done. Would it make sense for me to eat fewe larger meals. I usually eat 2 protein shakes daily and 2 meals. Is tough I work twelve hour days 6 days wekly. Im pretty ripped chest, arms, etc, but i want to pit on some inches on arms chest etc what u think? I usually get 2000-2500 calories and 200g potein give or take

I think you need to push your protein well over 300g per day, more on cycle-350g.
Lay out exactly what you eat, the point of eating 6-8 small meals isn't only to increase metabolism, its keep your body flush with protein so your muscle don't start eating themselves. In the abscence of protein and carbs, your body will start converting muscle to glucose for energy, which is why you need to ensure you have enough protein throughout the day.

Lay out exactly what you eat as this will make the difference. You need to make the most of the first cycle as this will be your most productive cycle, your body will never respond like it does with virgin receptors, but without adequate nutrition you won't get it and will lose it post cycle.

[DBOY]

BIG BUMP TO YO, he knows what he talkin about. you need to up your cals. big time. I also have a very high metabolism, that is a good thing if you know how to use it. I would recomend you take in at least 3500-4000 cals. a day. Wheather you are on cycle or not, has nothing to do with gaining weight. It is all diet, try to get that in check before your cycle and you will grow like no other. If you really have trouble putting on weight, try what i did, you will put on sum fat but thats all part of bulking, it will come of easily with a high metabolism. Its called GOMAD (gallon of milk a day), i recomend whole milk because its much higher in cals., this is not a long term thing only until you reach your goal (preffered weight). good luck

[lougizzle]

thanks guys. Im ready to hit it hard I can get my calories and protein up my main concen is how important is it that you must have hcg. I have all the goods to start now minus the hcg due to funds. Can anything be substituted for hcg or can I just use nolva trib etc. I dont want to mess up my first tme and I see alot of different opinions on going straight into nolva after cycle for 3 weeks w out hcg, but I see alot more people using hcg. Its hard to wait to get that one more piece of the puzzle. Should I wait until I get it or can I strt and be ok w/out it?

my protein shakes are cytosport cytogainer 600 calories 52 g protein. I use 3 cups milk with it to get a good blend the shit is so thick. So total on shakes are about 1200 calories and 80 g protein. I eat 1 morning and night. Inbetween I may eat subway for lunch with water. Chicken breast fo dinner w water. May not look that great, but im being honestThis puts me around 3,000 calories and 250g protein. This is a good day for me so I know I need to up it a little and I will. I drink water all day long too. Thanks guys

[yohimbe]

HCG isn't a necessity, I've run many cycles without it, but it will help you recover better, no doubt. The main thing with any cycle is recovery, no point in gaining on cycle and losing everything post cycle. this is where you're diet becomes so important as this is the only thing that allows to hold onto whatever gains you've made.

You need steak, mince, eggs and fats-olive oil, peanut butter. These are the keys to biulding maintaning muscle. I would really urge you to get the diet together before attempting the cycle, even if you have to wait a few months.

I'll post you a sample later.

[yohimbe]

Look something like this

Meal 1
Egg Yolk
Egg Whites
Oats
Meal 2
Peanut butter
Whey Protein Concentrate
olive oil/Mac Nut oil
Meal 3
Chicken
Almonds
olive oil/Mac Nut oil
Salad/veges
Meal 4
Peanut butter
Whey Protein Concentrate
olive oil/Mac Nut oil
Meal 5
Lean Beef Mince/Steak
Olive oil/Mac Nut oil
Salad/veges
Meal 6-Post workout
Peanut butter
Whey protein Concentrate
olive oil/Mac Nut oil
Waxy maize

[lougizzle]

i really appreciate your help yo!

[yohimbe]

Originally Posted by lougizzle

i really appreciate your help yo!

Anytime-try a this type of diet for a month before any juice so you can benchmark your natural gains. This is around 3,200-3,500 calories per day with around 300g protein, depending on your chicken and mince servings (300g minimum).
I guarantee you'll gain 10 lbs and be ready for some real results when you start cycle.

You also need to follwo this type of thing post cycle-you fats needs to be high as this helps with testosterone production.

[lougizzle]

thx again hey like i said i already have everthing but i will diet better first. i also have some anavar is there any place in a cycle for that? I just planned on dbol and test but the source screwed up my order and i got a bunch of anavar for free. also have u heard of t400 test mix of enan and cyp? its much cheaper than enan or cyp was curious?

[yohimbe]

Stick to dbol and test for a first cycle, you can hold on to var for a later stage.

Weeks 1-10 test 500mg per week
Weeks 1-4 dbol 40mg per day
Weeks 1-10 arimidex/letrozole-adex 0.25mg per day, letro 0.25 EOD. You don't have to take these straight away but have on hand in case of any estrogen problems.
If you are going to do HCG, 1,000iu weeks 3 and 4, 7 and 8, 11 and 12 starting the nolva end of week 12 (two weeks from last test e pin) for 4 weeks at 40mg per day.
Don't forget EFA's both on cycle and esp in pct, vit c (3,000 mg pct), tribulus.

[Gman]

Yo is spot on about your diet. Drop the cytogainer it's crap and stick to basic foods like chicken fish meat eggs fresh vegs...... precook your meals and have them ready for the week by Sunday package them up into those small plastic containers. Your protein intake is low, as Yo said, really concentrate hard on getting it up in the 300g range and you will see growth. This worked for me, for years I struggled to make gains but once I upped my protein my weight took off.

[lougizzle]

What do you rec for protein shakes? I use body building.com and cytogainer had the better reviews and was a little more expensive than the rest?

[yohimbe]

Whey concentrate with a spoon of peanut butter (30g) to slow the absorption is all you need. There's always some new found protein secret that will do this and do that and does fuckall. Good old whey concentrate and peanut butter and you can't go wrong.
Don't go for mass builders-they are loaded with carbs and sugar.

[tboney]

Originally Posted by lougizzle

thank bro Im ready to go I have eveything except hcg so thats why I ask. I have clomid nolva tribulus dbol test. First cycle so I didnt know if hcg was a necessity? Can I get by on the standard 22 day pct without hcg? Will I crash that hard?

I would not use hcg during pct. Use it at low doses during your cycle or the last two weeks before pct. If you do use it include an AI during that time.

I would def use both clomid and nolva during pct!!!

Tribulus will help with libido but will do nothing for raising test levels.