Designing a Cutting or Bulking Cycle by Anthony Roberts

Anthony Roberts post on deciding on a cutting or bulking cycle and the 3 classes of AAS: (Testosterone, 19-nor-Testosterone, and DiHydroTestosterone)

How to decide on a cutting or bulking cycle. If we’re going to be bulking, then the next compounds are very easy to choose. Generally, we find that steroids follow what’s called a linear response curve. Basically, that means that if you take more steroids, you gain more weight and strength (and usually lose more fat).

The more anabolic steroids you use, quantity-wise (lets say testosterone, for example), the more size, strength and weight you gain (2). Thus, creating a bulking cycle is reasonably simple. In general, I tend to stick with 2 compounds (testosterone and deca, perhaps) and use moderate to high doses of each. Of course, different compounds will give you more appreciable total weight gain than others, while still different compounds produce more "quality" gains with less water retention, but you get the general idea.

How long do we run a bulking cycle for? This is probably the most controversial part of this piece, but I think bulking cycles ought to be run until the target weight is achieved. In other words, if you have a goal of gaining 15lbs, you should run the cycle until you have reached the goal. This, of course is dependant on having realistic goals, but that’s a given, right? SO basically, my advice if you want to gain "X" lbs, then you stay on the cycle until you have. Why is it that on the internet and in magazines people arbitrarily say they’ll be cycling for 12 weeks or 8 weeks or 10 weeks? Why is it never 9 or 11 weeks? Because it’s arbitrary, that’s why. I think you should stay on a bulking cycle until you achieve your ultimate weight gain goal, or until such a time that you are uncomfortable staying on that cycle for. If you want to gain 20lbs, and you gain it in 10 weeks should you stop? Yeah, probably. Is there anything wrong with going to week 11 or 12? Of course not. But remember, at this point, you need to remember that your goal has been achieved and you should consider beginning PCT. Likewise, if you have gained 18lbs by week 12, I think you ought to stick out the cycle into week 13 to achieve your goal. Yes, that’s right…an odd numbered week. How controversial…

Cutting cycles are another animal altogether. Instead of simply relying on large amounts of drugs, you need to remember that when you are in a calorie restricted state, your sensitivity to exogenous androgens is going to be greater (3). Therefore, your selection of compounds needs to be given greater care than when you are simply trying to gain large amounts of weight. Remember, AAS are going to have a pronounced effect in the absence of ad libitum calories.

And to touch on the idea of how long you should stay on a cutting cycle, this is usually quite different from a bulker. Why? Because usually there is a very specific date or event that a cutting cycle is geared towards (a bodybuilding contest, swimsuit season, a photo shoot, etc…). So basically the "when do I end a cutting cycle/diet" is answered before you start…but if the goal is to get to X% bodyfat, then I think you should stay on until you reach that goal- again it has to be realistic however.

To figure out how to design a cutting cycle, I've been looking around at various cutting cycles, interviewing athletes and bodybuilders, reviewing records kept by the Russian and East German coaches and athletes, asking people what they've gotten their best results from, and keeping track of what compounds and dosages have been used. My main concern was (and is) what type of cycle has been producing the best results for people, and what similarities do the most productive cutting cycles share. The more I researched, the more I found out that there were trends within cutting cycles among experienced users, some of which will no doubt be surprising to you, and some of which will be pretty obvious.

One of the most clear and obvious trends I've noted has been the use of shorter esters in cutting cycles and longer esters in bulking cycles. This is not supported by any literature, but anecdotally, shorter estered drugs seem to be less likely to cause bloating. The Russian and East German programs also seemed to make more use of short esters. This means Testosterone Propionate would be preferable to Testosterone Enanthate or Cypionate and Nandrolone Phenyl Propionate would be preferable to the standard Deca (Nandrolone Decanoate), while testosterone Enanthate or Cypionate would still be fine for a bulking cycle.

This should come as no surprise to most people who are versed in the more common usage of anabolic steroids.

I once made the statement, in a previous work, that: "The most productive cutting cycles I've read about on the 'net ALL followed a simple structure. Every single one."

After explaining what the pattern was, hordes of experienced users on various internet discussion boards tried my idea. This was first discussed over a year ago, and since then, I’ve received numerous e-mails and read on various discussion boards that my methodology has been highly successful. And here’s why:

Every single highly successful cutting cycle I’ve ever looked at contained Testosterone. Some also contained another testosterone based compound as well. Eq is a popular addition here, and recently I’ve personally become a huge fan of Boldenone without an ester.

Every single highly successful cycle (but especially the "cutting cycles") utilized a 19-nor-testosterone based compound as well. The 19-nor family is well known for being very anabolic and not incredibly androgenic; indeed, this is why they were developed: to create a compound that widened the gap between the androgenic and anabolic characteristics, with emphasis on the anabolic portion. While the Trenbolone branch is very androgenic as well as anabolic, it has the distinction of possessing the strongest androgen receptor binding affinity of any injectable. Although my opinions often differ from Bill Roberts (and am not related to him, despite our names), at this point it is prudent to mention that I have noticed a trend in cutting cycles that makes use of his classification of androgens (which he referred to as class I and II respectively). While I am not in total agreement with that idea or classification theory, it is very useful in some ways. In short, I feel that a proper cutting cycle will contain some compounds which bind very strongly to the Androgen Receptor, and perhaps some others which have several non-receptor mediated mechanisms of action. These are called Class I and Class II androgens by Bill Roberts, and that nomenclature is simply a shorthand version for denoting whether a given androgen has mostly genomic or non-genomic effects.

And finally, whether looking at cycles posted on the internet, cycles of champion bodybuilders, or cycles based on the East German or Russian research, I’ve found that every really successful cycle I have looked at contained a DHT based compound as well. Generally Winstrol and/or Masteron were used. The East Germans used an obscure compound called Mestanolone as their DHT-derived component, but usually only towards the end of a cycle, and in minor amounts. This was most likely due to its effects on the CNS, which is typical of DHT derived steroids.

So what we have here is all 3 major families of Anabolic/Androgenic Steroids being represented in the East German research (Testosterone, 19-nor-Testosterone, and DiHydroTestosterone), and I also saw that in 99% of all HIGHLY PRODUCTIVE cycles that I examined. Remember, A/A steroids will all fall into one of the 3 categories I have mentioned, so combining all three into one cycle will make use of various different properties that they each have unique to their family. The athletic cycles I looked at seemed to be higher in the DHT category, and I found that the East Germans were quite fond of using what is known as a 4-chloro alteration in their steroids (Oral-Turinabol, Clostebol, etc…were all popular). For cycles where athletic performance is to be optimized, I’d recommend relying heavily on both DHT-derivations as well as anything with that 4-chloro alteration.

Remember that earlier part of this article where I told you that the body is more responsive to androgens when in a calorie deficient state? Well, I also noticed that most of the magic in successful cutting cycles is easily achieved with dosages under 2grams (total). Bulking cycles would appear to be hovering at the 1-2 gram mark, however. I know that personally, if I were to do a cutting cycle, I'd run around 400-500mgs or so each of a DHT, 19-nor, and Test based compound. Price would factor into things, I'm sure, as would availability. Currently, I think athletic cycles would still fall into the category of still having all 3 families of compounds in them, but the majority of that would be constituted by testosterone and DHT based drugs primarily,…if joint health is a problem, or joint pain, then more of a 19-nor (I would suggest Nandrolone Decanoate or Phenylpropionate) could be added in or substituted for the DHT-based one…with the DHT based one being added in only at the end. In other words, it would probably be a predominantly two compound cycle, with the DHT/19-nor compounds being subject to manipulation for joint comfort.

SO what is the cash-value of all of this? What are we going to take with us in our steroid "wallet" to design a cycle? Well, since we know we’re starting with testosterone, I can tell you that I'd almost always include something like Trenbolone with Winstrol in a cutting cycle. Tren binds very strongly to the Androgen Receptor, and Winstrol binds rather poorly...by combining them, we may have some additional synergy with regards to genomic and non-genomic action. NPP (Nandrolone Phenylpropionate) also has a reasonably strong bind to the AR, so it may be substituted for Tren, but probably not used alongside it with any appreciable synergy. And of course, using either of those without Testosterone would kill your sex life. DHT based steroids tend to bind poorly, and 19-nors tend to bind tightly…which makes our decision on what to include in a cycle very easy…by combining DHT-based and 19-nor-based steroids, we’ll almost always be making use of strong Androgen Receptor Binding and weak binding. In this regard, we’re now filling our wallet with the hundreds and fifties. The hundreds are the compound (aside from testosterone) that we are going to be relying on primarily to influence the cycle. If we’re going for a cutting cycle, those would be our DHT-derivations (Masteron, Anavar, etc…). If we have joint problems, then we are throwing in some Nandrolone. If our primary concern is athleticism but we still want to get cut…well….then our wallet needs to be filled with perhaps some twenties, some fifties, and maybe a few tens also…so that would be our testosterone, a low dose of Nandrolone to keep joints healthy, and them maybe some Anavar or something to that effect the week or two prior to a competition. Oh…and don’t forget some singles…Methyltestosterone or Halotestin to be used just prior to competing.

Since I haven’t really touched on orals yet, I have to say that generally I consider them very much to be situational specific tools, because we can’t exactly run them for the same amount of time we run injectables. In general, I’d say that even moderate to high doses of orals can be run for up to six weeks at least, and low to moderate doses can be run for even longer- up to 10 weeks I’d say. Now, I know that this goes against traditional thinking, but honestly, I’ve done the research and really haven’t seen any irreversible effects from such dosing when it’s done in healthy males. Of course, if you have a pre-existing liver problem or high cholesterol, then this wouldn’t apply to you. Orals like anadrol and dianabol are generally used in spurts to achieve massive but quick growth. Anavar or Winstrol are typically used at the end of cutting cycles, etc…basically most of the time, I consider orals to be the singles in our wallet. You usually only need them for very specific instances and usually only briefly. Generally they find their way in my cycles only to achieve very specific goals, just as singles usually only find their way into my REAL wallet when I need tip money at the bar…

What I’m ultimately saying here, is that we need a bunch of different types of bills in our wallet, depending on where we’re going – meaning that we need to design cycles around our goals, not just around what sexy new drug we feel like using. You wouldn’t go to McDonalds with a wallet full of hundreds, right? You can’t even use them there! So, while it’s appealing to try to use obscure compounds that look sexy and cool…and get a lot of play on silly invite-boards and such…its not a great idea. Just like a hundred dollar bill at McDonalds…it’s not going to get you what you want.

There it is...how I would design a cycle for optimal results, using optimal compounds and dosages. As a last word, I'd like to remind everyone that diet and training will be part of your cycle-puzzle, and that the dugs mentioned above will make things easier...but they certainly will not make you ripped or huge on their own.

Combine those 3 families of steroids, and different receptor binding abilities, and you’ll have a very potent cycle. Use high(ish) doses and you have a very nice bulking cycle. Now that you have an understanding of how I design my own cycles, I’ll leave you to design your own.

I been reading your articles and want to give say:
Thank you for all the information you filling us with!

I really like this one especially from him, cause he gets into the meat of why you should combine different classes of steroids...It makes total sense...

[admin]

He was disappointed that this article didn't turn out as 'big' as it did. No one really made a big deal of it.

No kidding...I wonder why it didn't take off...Probably because he's got so many other damn good articles, his articles were competing with one another...

Thanks thats a great post..

Originally Posted by Admin

He was disappointed that this article didn't turn out as 'big' as it did. No one really made a big deal of it.

I don't think I wrote it very well, or maybe it was something else...

I have no idea. I look back at this article, which should have been my biggest, and just...have no idea WTF happened with it..

they say its better later than never i just read this amazing stuff ty by the way how can get one of your books

[maxgtl]

Still a little confused on the three different types (classes) of steroids, is there a simplified chart anywhere that is a quick reference tool to see what steroids fit into which catogory?

[Action]

Maybe this would help a bit:

List of Test/DHT derived AAS

[maxgtl]

thank you. i will post a thread in the vip section later about the cycle i am about to start. i really would appreciate your opinion (expertice).

[maxgtl]

I had to go back and search for this article to read it again. There is so much great information in here for people to read, especially new people looking to stack. Is there a way to post it at the front because so many new people get on here as I did and ask for advice on starting a cycle.

[Action]

We could keep bumping it so it stays near the top, but it's already been removed from the regular forum and placed in Archived Greats.

[triathletesg]

Hello, can you give an example cycle for someone who is looking to compete in a race, where being strong, yet lightweight is the goal. I am already light, but, I dont want to gain too much weight, yet want to get stronger. What kinds, how much, and for how long before the race would you recommend? Where can I get example routeins for various peoples purposes of use?
Thanks...

[zidane9979]

Originally Posted by triathletesg

Hello, can you give an example cycle for someone who is looking to compete in a race, where being strong, yet lightweight is the goal. I am already light, but, I dont want to gain too much weight, yet want to get stronger. What kinds, how much, and for how long before the race would you recommend? Where can I get example routeins for various peoples purposes of use?
Thanks...

i responded on the "Steroid Cycles " section already, so check it out