Proviron

[Replicator]

Proviron (Mesterolone)Profiles

[Under-Radar]

This info is already in the archives and proviron is a poor choice for an anti e. it however will give you a sufficient hard on and does have its uses. but as for as preventing estrogen build-up and being a great anti e its all hogwash. i am a competior and am on the NPC level circuit and I tell you this is information I personally would not want my clients or any newbe to read as it would allow them to think that they could very well order a cycle without the proper pct and use proviron in its place. just my 2 cents which is proven and from experience with myself and others.

Let me also state Replicator that What you have presented us with is someones opinion on what proviron does. To demonstrate to me that i am way off base is easy, simply post a reference to anything in "scientific " literature showing an anti-aromatase effect. Proviron is NOT dihydrotestosterone and does NOT share all of dihydrotestosterone's characteristics. I am perfectly willing to believe that it works for you but just becasue someone repeats something over and over does not make it so. THere is NO evidence in the scientific literature that demonstrates an anti-e effect, i can find NO reference in the scientific literature demonstrating its binding affinity to the aromatase enzyme. I will grant you that it does bind to sex hormone binding globulin but it releases more estrogen than testosterone. Simply by taking more test you will reduce the amount of sex hormone binding globulin and increase your free test and save money at the same time.

When i took proviron, i did not get gynecomastia either but then again i am not gynecomastia prone. For all the other anti-e's commonly recommended there is a ton of scientific evidence that they actually either block the production of estrogen or bind/block the estrogen receptors. For proviron there is NO evidence except the written opinion of some gurus that never cite sources and some anecdotal evidence. I would feel very uncomfortable advising someone to hang their gynecomastia hat on proviron unless they had a fistfull of Nolvadex ready just in case!! At least Nolvadex has been clinically shown to reduce or totally eliminate gynecomastia and it is cheaper! So for me it is simple, add a little more test and have Nolvadex on hand vs the more expensive proviron that has never been clinically proven to reduce or eliminate estro or gynecomastia.

I find so many guys trying to take so many different drugs, personally the KISS principle rules after many years of trying all of these. Test is the base of every cycle with Nolvadex always handy if the need arises.

But remember its certainly a poor choice if estrogen blockage is your primary course of action. Proviron would be a good choice to slightly lower estrogen to within maintainable ranges, but for actually inhibiting aromatization I would think something like Arimidex is more suited. " U.R

[Replicator]

It may be a poor choice for you and the above is only your opinion and is also only sour grapes because of a previous incident, but I will take my advice from the proffesionals who come up with it, you tell me why would the likes of AnabolicFacts.com talk bull shit, what have they to gain ????. I am mearly trying to pass the information on
SO
get off my back U.R , YOU are getting heavy!!
REP

[powerman]

Rep id have to agree at 310# he must be gettin awful heavy....BWAhahahaha

[Action]

Originally Posted by Under-Radar

This info is already in the archives and proviron is a poor choice for an anti e. it however will give you a sufficient hard on and does have its uses. but as for as preventing estrogen build-up and being a great anti e its all hogwash. i am a competior and am on the NPC level circuit and I tell you this is information I personally would not want my clients or any newbe to read as it would allow them to think that they could very well order a cycle without the proper pct and use proviron in its place. just my 2 cents which is proven and from experience with myself and others.

Let me also state Replicator that What you have presented us with is someones opinion on what proviron does. To demonstrate to me that i am way off base is easy, simply post a reference to anything in "scientific " literature showing an anti-aromatase effect. Proviron is NOT dihydrotestosterone and does NOT share all of dihydrotestosterone's characteristics. I am perfectly willing to believe that it works for you but just becasue someone repeats something over and over does not make it so. THere is NO evidence in the scientific literature that demonstrates an anti-e effect, i can find NO reference in the scientific literature demonstrating its binding affinity to the aromatase enzyme. I will grant you that it does bind to sex hormone binding globulin but it releases more estrogen than testosterone. Simply by taking more test you will reduce the amount of sex hormone binding globulin and increase your free test and save money at the same time.

When i took proviron, i did not get gynecomastia either but then again i am not gynecomastia prone. For all the other anti-e's commonly recommended there is a ton of scientific evidence that they actually either block the production of estrogen or bind/block the estrogen receptors. For proviron there is NO evidence except the written opinion of some gurus that never cite sources and some anecdotal evidence. I would feel very uncomfortable advising someone to hang their gynecomastia hat on proviron unless they had a fistfull of Nolvadex ready just in case!! At least Nolvadex has been clinically shown to reduce or totally eliminate gynecomastia and it is cheaper! So for me it is simple, add a little more test and have Nolvadex on hand vs the more expensive proviron that has never been clinically proven to reduce or eliminate estro or gynecomastia.

I find so many guys trying to take so many different drugs, personally the KISS principle rules after many years of trying all of these. Test is the base of every cycle with Nolvadex always handy if the need arises.

But remember its certainly a poor choice if estrogen blockage is your primary course of action. Proviron would be a good choice to slightly lower estrogen to within maintainable ranges, but for actually inhibiting aromatization I would think something like Arimidex is more suited. " U.R

Have to correct you on this one UR. Proviron is a DHT. I agree that it is weaker in comparison to other AI's like Letro, Arimi and Aroma.

[Under-Radar]

Originally Posted by Replicator

It may be a poor choice for you and the above is only your opinion and is also only sour grapes because of a previous incident, but I will take my advice from the proffesionals who come up with it, you tell me why would the likes of AnabolicFacts.com talk bull shit, what have they to gain ????. I am mearly trying to pass the information on
SO
get off my back U.R , YOU are getting heavy!!
REP

First off Rep lets get one thing understood. I am not holding gruges and do not live my life to suit yours by picking on you. I am a grown man who can hold and handle my own and was giving my thoughts. After talking with Dave Palumbo who has his medical degree said the same thing. As for anabolifacts.com you cant believe everything you hear. Alo0t of written literature on compounds does not give a broad explanation about certain compounds. That is why every year pro boadybuilders and atheletes are always changing their drug protocol.

And what do you mean sour grapes. If you really think I am after you . you have got to be one of the loneliest guys on the planet. Why cant we have a difference in opinion without you going their. Its obvious that you are still bothered since you are the one implying about the past. Tell ya what ask ACTION, ZIDANE OR those whom I have had debates with and they will tell you that it can be done professionally and without hostility. So again who are your professionals. show me direct proof and medical literature that proviron is an anti e. and remember I know where your info is coming from as the literature still does not show real proof.

[Replicator]

Whatever ...........

[Under-Radar]

Originally Posted by Action

Have to correct you on this one UR. Proviron is a DHT. I agree that it is weaker in comparison to other AI's like Letro, Arimi and Aroma.

never said it was'nt. I said despite some of the old literature proviron is not really a anti-estrogen and yes it is a androgen without any interaction on the female hormone level (it doesn't aromatize itself) and on the hypophyse. So because it increases the free testoterone level and doesn't raise the estrogen level THE EFFECT of the female hormone is reduced.

That is to say that the ratio female hormone/ free male hormone is reduced because the free male hormone is increased and not the female hormone level. The female hormone level is not decreased! ( Proviron is not used to cure ovary or breast cancer therefor it is not look at as an anti-e by the medical professional simply because it can not reduce the estrogen in females during breast cancer. and of course I have a whole heap of other proof.

[Under-Radar]

Originally Posted by Replicator

Whatever ...........

and their is a difference between an anti-e and a anti aromastane...

[Replicator]

Originally Posted by Under-Radar

never said it was'nt. I said despite some of the old literature proviron is not really a anti-estrogen

Proviron is also an estrogen antagonist which prevents the aromatization of steroids. Unlike the antiestrogen Nolvadex which only blocks the estrogen receptors (see Nolvadex) Proviron already prevents the aromatizing of steroids

and yes it is a androgen without any interaction on the female hormone level (it doesn't aromatize itself) and on the hypophyse. So because it increases the free testoterone level and doesn't raise the estrogen level THE EFFECT of the female hormone is reduced.

That is to say that the ratio female hormone/ free male hormone is reduced because the free male hormone is increased and not the female hormone level. The female hormone level is not decreased! ( Proviron is not used to cure ovary or breast cancer therefor it is not look at as an anti-e by the medical professional simply because it can not reduce the estrogen in females during breast cancer. and of course I have a whole heap of other proof.

exactly its better tha that it stops it before it even starts, hence the reason it is good to take right through a cycle ,
And you dont know where I get my info from , do you think I only have one source .......... and personal experiance tells me the writings are correct , cant argue with that now can we.
REP

[Under-Radar]

Originally Posted by Replicator

exactly its better tha that it stops it before it even starts, hence the reason it is good to take right through a cycle ,
And you dont know where I get my info from , do you think I only have one source .......... and personal experiance tells me the writings are correct , cant argue with that now can we.
REP

Brother you really need to calm down. why do you answer Action qoute. your response is immature and still proves nothing that I have not already stated. stop going off mines and others literature. My writings are from my mouth and not some add or literature as yours is. Please is you know how to debate lets do it. and I guarantee you you wont have a leg to stand on. I wont to hear your response right from your own mouth not some book. other than that you wont get far with me in a debate. Im ready lets go. The only time I will stop a debate is if I feel like Im beating a dead horse. Other than that I waiting.

[Replicator]

Originally Posted by Under-Radar

Brother you really need to calm down.
I couldnt be any calmer

why do you answer Action qoute.
Is there a rule that says I cant.
your response is immature and still proves nothing that I have not already stated.
you have stated nothing more than words from another

stop going off mines
I have never AND WOULD NEVER USE YOUR LITERATURE.
YOUR ACUSSATIONS ARE BORING
and others literature.
We all share litrature and self experience , is that not what A BOARD IS ALL ABOUT DOH

My writings are from my mouth
I THINK THIS MUST BE QUIT BIG
and not some add or literature as yours is.
Accustions again bro ...careful , i also write from self experience.

Please is you know how to debate lets do it.
I have nothing more to say to you , you seem to revel in being annoying and childish with a hint of bullying tactics,whatever someone says you have to down it with all your bullshit

and I guarantee you you wont have a leg to stand on.
See what I mean, WTF is that about ....who cares.

I wont to hear your response right from your own mouth not some book. other than that you wont get far with me in a debate.
Wooooooooooooooooooo scary, go debate yourself bro am sick of ye already. I have put across my points from my experiences and the written word of many more.thats it from me

Im ready lets go. The only time I will stop a debate is if I feel like Im beating a dead horse. Other than that I waiting.

Now go beat your dead horse bro coz i aint playing yer gay games.
It ENDS RIGHT HERE!!!

REP

[Action]

Oh brother, here we go again!

[Replicator]

Originally Posted by Action

Oh brother, here we go again!

Nope Action its not happening,
I did not join this site for that , i will be ignoring any further provocating posts, you have to have a bit of give and take, theres just none with this guy , Jesus its like arguing with the wife .............and she thinks she's right all the time as well LOL

[Under-Radar]

Originally Posted by Action

Oh brother, here we go again!

No Action its not here we go again. I can debate without using profanity and feel like Rep is trying to start something he wont be able to handle and I personally wont fall into that trap again as I did before. Debate and debate some more if you ask me. But if you have to start using profanity as a way to express yourself and get your point across then that tells me I have already won the debate and I can move on to other post that I feel i differ in opinion and post that are not just Rep but anyone. Either that or someone needs to explain to Rep that the profanity is uncalled for. RESPECT................ I may dissagree but I wont disrepect someone for their opinion. Either that or it tells me where I need to be.